Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Abraham Lubelski (3rd nomination)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. No consensus for salting, however. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 06:26, 25 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Abraham Lubelski (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log · Stats)

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Fails GNG and NARTIST, as there is no significant coverage in independent reliable sources. Probably should be redirected to NYArts the magazine he ran which is notable, in so much as it is infamous as a pay-to-play scam. I would have done so directly, except article was nominated thrice (2005, 2005, 2007), so bringing it here out of respect for process.

The first two discussion closed with little discussion and no consensus (though a clear sense this was likely vanity cruft), and the third closed in 2007 as keep, but without properly verifying the claims in the article. That discussion hinged around two claims for N: exhibition at the Venice Bienniale, and a sentence fragment on the Hermitage site, both of which were misleading or taken out of context.

The first claim is misleading if not downright false: he was not part of the Bienniale in such a way that would satisfy ARTIST 4(b) (e.g. a national pavilion or the main group exhibition) but rather was merely in one of dozens of private exhibitions mounted in Venice at the same time as the Biennale; furthermore that exhibition had 250 artists in it who "were asked to e-mail their submissions as digital files. These were printed out, placed in plastic sleeves and brought to Venice for installation. Hung from criss-crossing lengths of string at the Church of S. Maria Ausiliatrice"[1]

The Hermitage language comes from website promotional material about a panel he spoke on: "There will be meetings with Anna Frants, Abraham Lubelski, Jolanta Gora-Wita (New York), who are widely known in the world of media artists and curators."[2] The current website says "Within the context of this program, on 8 April there was a Round Table discussion entitled "Hacking as an Art" with participation by Russian and foreign Internet artists, programmers and curators. There were lectures by the publisher and editor-in-chief of NY ARTS Magazine, consultant on questions of art, and artist in the performance genre, Abraham Lubelski - "Media Art as a Properly Constructed Business" - and by the media artist and curator Jolanta Gora-Wita - "Internet Culture as the Art of Communication.""[3]

Pinging @Bus stop, Freshacconci, Eastmain, Tyrenius, DGG, and Vassyana: who were participants in the second substantive discussion. Theredproject (talk) 15:16, 17 May 2020 (UTC) Theredproject (talk) 15:16, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Artists-related deletion discussions. Theredproject (talk) 15:16, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Arts-related deletion discussions. Theredproject (talk) 15:16, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Visual arts-related deletion discussions. Theredproject (talk) 15:16, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete the only notability here seems to stem from having run a reportedly sketchy art business.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 16:27, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@ThatMontrealIP: I agree with your assessment (see mine below). What are your thoughts on salting the article as well? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kbabej (talk • contribs)

We're on the fourth AFD, but it does not appear the article has ever been deleted and recreated. Correct me if I am wrong.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 18:26, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ah, yes, you are correct. Don't know why I was thinking that it was recreated. Striking the salt portion of my !vote below. Thanks! --Kbabej (talk) 19:45, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete and salt. Observer states he sold an apartment, and then there's a smattering of coverage saying he scammed artists out of thousands, but his artwork isn't notable. As we're on the third or fourth iteration of this article, I suggest this be salted. --Kbabej (talk) 17:35, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete As an artist, I can't see what on earth he could be known for. I can find only find one (group) exhibition that he appears to have been in. I can't find anything about his work, or even just an image of a work he might have made. Vexations (talk) 19:17, 17 May 2020 (UTC) (expand) As a curator, he has the same problem. He has never curated anything that has received significant critical attention. There is some coverage of him as an editor, but those are mostly accusations of operating a scam that have not been proven in court. Vexations (talk) 21:54, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep. as Isaid last time, curators can be notable independent of their own art work. So can editors of major magazines. (If not, merge to the article on the magazine) DGG ( talk ) 21:41, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment. His magaizine, NYArts, has been nominated for deletion here. --Kbabej (talk) 22:06, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete per nom. The article is blatant WP:PROMO, and was partially written by Lubelski himself. KidAd (talk) 22:25, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete the sourcing may have been enough to justify an article back in 2005 when we did not actually have notability criteria but it is not enough to justify an article now.John Pack Lambert (talk) 19:02, 18 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.