Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2009 April 8

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April 8

Category:Museums in the Arab League

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: delete. Kbdank71 14:34, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Category:Museums in the Arab League (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Nominator's rationale: Delete. I'm not sure why we would want to use a multinational political organization as the basis for categorizing museums. Category:Museums in the North Atlantic Treaty Organization, anyone? List of museums in the Arab League already exists, created recently by the same user that created the category, who is (surprise) User:Arab League. Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:07, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Leon County historic buildings

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: yay! I mean rename. Kbdank71 14:34, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Propose renaming Category:Leon County historic buildings to Category:Historic buildings of Leon County, Florida
Nominator's rationale: Technical nomination. Found doing March cleanup. Vegaswikian (talk) 22:59, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Pittsburgh inclines

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:Railway inclines in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. Kbdank71 14:33, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Propose renaming Category:Pittsburgh inclines to Category:Railway lines in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
Nominator's rationale: Technical nomination. Found doing March cleanup. Vegaswikian (talk) 22:47, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Note that this category was briefly discussed on the project's talk page and no objections were raised there. If someone thinks this is the correct action, I'd suggest posting something on the project talk page about this upmerge. Vegaswikian (talk) 22:54, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Neighborhoods in Pittsburgh

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: rename. Kbdank71 14:32, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Propose renaming Category:Neighborhoods in Pittsburgh to Category:Neighborhoods in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
Nominator's rationale: Technical nomination. Found this apparently incompletion nomination doing March cleanup. Vegaswikian (talk) 22:44, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Pittsburgh coaches

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: Delete. Good Ol’factory (talk) 10:16, 12 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Propose renaming Category:Pittsburgh coaches to Category:Coaches from the Pittsburgh metropolitan area
Nominator's rationale: Rename. Found doing cleanup as an incomplete nomination to delete. The introduction clearly states that this covers the metro area of 7 counties so a rename seems to be the best choice here. I see no reason to delete. The proposed name better matches the other subcategories under the sports parent.Vegaswikian (talk) 22:36, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete. I could swear I nominated this one too. I think an entire nomination of mine disappeared in all my cutting and pasting. Well, regardless, this is the only category that attempts to group coaches by city or municipal area, which seems a trivial intersection, so I favor deleting it.--Mike Selinker (talk) 22:42, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete, upmerge subcategories to Category:Sportspeople from Pennsylvania. I've looked at the one (1) article, it's only a stub. The subcategories are the only sticking point, and a broader state view will better match the various "players" subcategories. (This has been sitting around unresolved for over a month, so I'm weighing in to give a 2:1 ratio.)
    --William Allen Simpson (talk) 03:49, 11 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Parks in Pittsburgh

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: Rename as nominated; allow pruning and creation of Category:Parks in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. May want to re-evaluate need for both after pruning and re-organizing occurs. Good Ol’factory (talk) 01:30, 15 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I've created Category:Parks in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. Both seem fine now.--Mike Selinker (talk) 05:05, 15 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]


Propose renaming Category:Parks in Pittsburgh to Category:Parks in the Pittsburgh metropolitan area
Nominator's rationale: Rename. Found doing cleanup as an incomplete renomination to Category:Parks in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. I'm renominating with a different name since the introduction clearly says it is for the metro area and in fact lists the 7 counties included. Vegaswikian (talk) 22:27, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Gamble and Huff songs

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: rename. Kbdank71 14:31, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Propose renaming Category:Gamble and Huff songs to Category:Songs written by Gamble and Huff
Nominator's rationale: The songs listed in this category were written, not recorded, by Gamble and Huff. --Richhoncho (talk) 20:28, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:ITunes radio

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: delete. Kbdank71 14:30, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Category:ITunes radio (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Nominator's rationale: I don't see any point in this category. I may be wrong on this, but afaik there is no such thing as "iTunes radio". Of course, iTunes can pick up audio streams, like many media players can, but that doesn't make the stations it picks up "iTunes radio stations", right? Otherwise, we might as well start categories called "Winamp radio", "Windows Media Player radio", etc. Jimmy Fleischer (talk) 18:26, 8 April 2009 (UTC) Jimmy Fleischer (talk) 18:26, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
well, there are a number of articles in this category. Do you think all of them wrong? Do you think the discussion wrong at the section on Internet radio in the itunes article? DGG (talk) 03:11, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Straight answer: Yes. Jimmy Fleischer (talk) 07:28, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Protest Records

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: delete. Kbdank71 14:30, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Category:Protest Records (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Nominator's rationale: Delete - small category for an online record label that, since it is defunct, is unlikely to expand in any significant fashion. The two articles are interlinked and the lead article can certainly be expanded should the need arise. Otto4711 (talk) 13:56, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Vietnamese ornithologists

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: keep. Kbdank71 14:39, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Category:Vietnamese ornithologists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Nominator's rationale: Overcategorisation. One member, unlikely to ever be any more. This, that and the other [talk] 10:00, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:American defenders of slavery

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:American pro-slavery activists--Aervanath (talk) 05:33, 16 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Category:American defenders of slavery (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Nominator's rationale: Delete. Overcategorization by isolated political opinion. Also not defining for those in antebellum years, since most elected politicians from the South were defenders of slavery. All the Republican opponents were elected from free states, while the South was solidly Democratic pro-slavery. Hence the Civil War. Many similar categories by isolated political opinion have been deleted, including:
Wikipedia:Categories_for_deletion/Log/2006_July_23#Category:Pro-gun_politicians
Wikipedia:Categories_for_deletion/Log/2006_October_9#Opponents_and supporters of_capital_punishment
Wikipedia:Categories_for_deletion/Log/2006_October_9#Anti-gay_rights_politicians and media_personalities
Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2007_March_21#Politicians_by_stance_on_abortion_issues
Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2007_May_27#Category:People_opposed_to_apartheid
Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2007_May_30#Category:Supporters_of_apartheid
Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2007_June_1#Category:Proponents_of_free_trade
Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2007_September_25#Opponents_and_proponents_of_Alaska_statehood
Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2008_February_22#Category:Contemporary_public_figures_opposed_to_lowering_the_voting_age_to_18
Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2008_October_21#Category:Americans_favoring_drug_legalization
Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2009_March_4#Congressional_opponents_of... — Good Ol’factory (talk) 09:25, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Dukes of the First French Empire

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: relist to Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2009_April_16#Dukes_of_the_First_French_Empire--Aervanath (talk) 05:38, 16 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: UpMerge to parent Category:Dukes of the First French Empire. These categories were created 18 months ago and they only contain 1-4 articles (most of them 1). I think this is covered by WP:OC#SMALL. Parent category contains 14 articles. I think it's rational to have a category with 40-50 articles. -- Magioladitis (talk) 07:55, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Diseases that cause abortion

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: delete all. Kbdank71 14:28, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Category:Diseases that cause abortion (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Nominator's rationale: This is better covered by an article, as most of these diseases do not invariably cause abortion and the categorisation is therefore potentially misleading. JFW | T@lk 06:21, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Co-nomination. Category:Diseases that only cause abortion in animals (the subcategory).
  • Delete per nom and as co-nominator. Good Ol’factory (talk) 09:32, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename/move. Have you considered renaming it? How about "Diseases that may cause abortion" and "Diseases that may cause abortion in animals". Ferrylodge (talk) 15:23, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete this isn't an established way of categorizing diseases on wikipedia. Take for example the first one of the list, chlamydia. Abortion isn't even mentioned in the lead. What is mentioned? Urethritis, epididymitis, and dysuria. Do we have Category:Diseases that cause urethritis? If we aren't even categorizing diseases by their major symptoms or related conditions, it seems quite odd to categorize them by their minor symptoms or related conditions. Do we have Category:Diseases that cause death (or Category:Terminal diseases?) let alone Category:Diseases that cause nausea or Category:Diseases that cause headache? I'll repeat, this simply isn't an established way of categorizing diseases on wikipedia. This material would probably work better as a list or stand alone article. This isn't what categorization is for. -Andrew c [talk] 15:50, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    The Chlamydia article says: "Chlamydia can affect infants by causing spontaneous abortion." I have no problem using a list instead of a category for all this stuff (if you promise to support the list!). I'm not sure I see the big difference between doing it as a list versus doing it as a category.Ferrylodge (talk) 15:54, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    Wikipedia:Categories, lists, and navigation templates and since the main article is titled miscarriage, it may be better to use that term instead of "abortion". That use of abortion, while technically accurate, seems like jargon and could cause confusion in the lay reader.-Andrew c [talk] 16:01, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    Would you be okay with "List of diseases that may cause miscarriage in humans” and "List of diseases that may cause miscarriage in animals"?Ferrylodge (talk) 16:04, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    Now that I think about it, that list seems like a spin off of Miscarriage#Causes. There are 8 items in the category. I'm not sure why we shouldn't just add the list (maybe even in prose from) to Miscarriage#Causes. Do we really need to spin off content? Due we go into so much depth at Miscarriage#Causes, that we need a stand alone article to cover a list of 8 diseases? We already mention 2. Doesn't seem like that big of a deal to add 6 more.-Andrew c [talk] 16:11, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    It's way more than eight. Add fourteen here. The list will be expanded too. Whatever you want, Andrew c, I will do.Ferrylodge (talk) 16:13, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    List of diseases that may cause miscarriage.Ferrylodge (talk) 18:09, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete disease by symptom is a bad precedent. Category:Diseases that cause fevers, Category:Diseases that cause death, Category:Diseases that cause flatulence, Category:Diseases that cause nausea ad nauseum Carlossuarez46 (talk) 17:33, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename to Category:Diseases that may cause miscarriage per parent article List of diseases that may cause miscarriage. Alansohn (talk) 18:40, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    Parent article? You are in error. Ferrylodge started that article[1] two hours after the cat he started[2] was listed for discussion here. KillerChihuahua?!? 23:34, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete and most certainly do not rename to miscarriage, that is another poorly named medical piece, in this case an article. KillerChihuahua?!? 22:31, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete - disease by symptom is untenable. Most if not all diseases have multiple symptoms and categorizing them will lead to a knot of unhelpful categories on disease articles. Otto4711 (talk) 22:40, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete. As a category or list, whether using the word "abortion" or "miscarriage", it's misleading by gross oversimplification, can be unnecessarily worrisome to those who aren't in any danger, and might be potentially harmful to those who might actually be in danger, particularly for casual readers that happen upon it and might choose to rely upon it. In other words, it's junk-- worse than useless. ... Kenosis (talk) 23:05, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Kenosis, just FYI, there was an objection that the abortion article mentioned only two diseases that can cause miscarriage in animals.[3] Since many diseases can do that, I did not think it appropriate to list them all in that article. A list seemed like a better way to do it, if done properly, but maybe you're right that we should just let it all go down the memory hole. Anyway, I guess the present discussion is mainly about the category, not the list.Ferrylodge (talk) 03:06, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I stand by what I said. If the relevant articles are properly written, there's no need for a potentially very misleading list of this kind upon which cursory readers who encounter it might mistakenly rely to their personal detriment. ... Kenosis (talk) 16:55, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Okay, thanks again for your comments, Kenosis. I'm sure we'll get this worked out to everyone's satisfaction. Maybe this evening, I'll try to put the list (List of diseases that may cause miscarriage) in narrative form, as a section of the miscarriage article (no time right this minute, though). On the other hand, maybe the list will come up for deletion, and other editors will see a way to make the list less potentially misleading.Ferrylodge (talk) 17:04, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Ferrylodge, this is precisely why you are on Arbcom probation regarding Abortion articles. I mention that one section needs work, and you do the least encyclopedic and most disruptive unhelpful thing. Please note the concern was not that we didn't have a laundry list of all possible diseases, but that we only list two diseases and don't mention parasites or pharmacological causes. This is unbalanced and inaccurate. You are making it MORE unbiased and inaccurate, and cluttering the Cat list with a Cat which is completely inappropriate. You either didn't bother to check precedent on medical Cats, or you don't understand them; you either didn't bother to read my concern, or else you willfully misunderstood it; you create and/or exacerbate problems and issues. You really need to consider removing yourself from the Abortion family of articles before the community tires of the time spent discussing and cleaning up your ill conceived notions of "improvement" or at the very least spend more time reading and trying to understand. KillerChihuahua?!? 10:10, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
KC, would you please try not to make a point of following me around and telling everyone about an event at ArbCom from 2007? That would be much appreciated. As far as the Cat, I have no problem removing the Cat, but am not so sure about the List. As I said to Andrew c above, "Whatever you want, Andrew c, I will do." Was that statement of mine an outrageous ArbCom violation? I think not. Please try to back off a bit, okay? An admin suggested earlier this week that you stop hounding me.[4] Another admin said earlier this week that you "inappropriately" banned me from an article this month.[5] Considering our past interactions, perhaps you should consider removing yourself from your present role as my personal supervisor. Thanks.Ferrylodge (talk) 16:25, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
P.S. I can't remember if I've ever created a category at Wikipedia before. In any event, I do so very rarely. If I erred here, it certainly was not intentional. I'm a pretty decent editor, but I don't always do everything right the first time. Maybe I didn't do such a horrible thing here, if Alansohn supports it. And by the way, there's no way that any POV is associated with what I did here, AFAIK. I think we're all pretty much opposed to diseases.Ferrylodge (talk) 16:46, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I believe I've been editing the Abortion family of articles longer than you, so I could far more plausibly accuse you of following me around! However, I am quite aware it is just that in some areas, our article interests overlap. Surely you have noticed that the same group of editors commonly edit the same group of articles? If not, allow me to assure you that this is a common occurance, and there is no need or reason to ABF and accuse other editors who share your intersts of stalking you. KillerChihuahua?!? 19:15, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I have not accused you here of stalking. What I have asked you to ease up on is the following combination: "following me around and telling everyone about an event at ArbCom from 2007." Thanks.Ferrylodge (talk) 19:24, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Well, saying I'm "following you around" is accusing me of stalking. KillerChihuahua?!? 20:58, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
"If 'following another user around' is accompanied by tendentiousness, personal attacks, or other disruptive behavior, it may become a very serious matter and could result in blocks and other editing restrictions."[6] If it's not accompanied by that stuff, it doesn't seem like a big problem. Anyway, discussing this here does not seem very appropriate for this talk page, so let's not.Ferrylodge (talk) 21:12, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete per Otto4711. Odd nature (talk) 23:15, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete per JFW. Categories are essentially unannotated lists, and the diseases involved would need considerable annotation. In animals it's even more so: what causes spontaneous abortion in pigs is probably not the same agent that would cause it in goats, rabbits, or dogs... let alone aardvarks :-). --SB_Johnny | talk 18:49, 10 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    Would someone please delete the categories? I made them, and hereby again approve deleting them. As I said above, "I have no problem removing the Cat." Also, FYI, the list has also been deleted per the talk page discussion here, where User:Tznkai stated that it is useful information, and she is trying "to think of a middle ground." Thanks. Another editor mentioned that the information is useful, and it would be a "Shame to see it disappear into the Wiki ether without the info being included in Miscarriage."[7]Ferrylodge (talk) 19:01, 10 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Bruce Dickinson members

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: delete. Kbdank71 14:22, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Propose deleting Category:Bruce Dickinson members
Nominator's rationale: Unlike the category below, this isn't really a band, it's a series of musicians on Dickinson's solo projects.--Mike Selinker (talk) 05:02, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete - too vague for categorisation purposes. Occuli (talk) 12:08, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete - I'm pretty sure that Bruce Dickinson has just one member (sorry for the lame pun). As for the members of the Bruce Dickinson band, which this obviously refers to, there is no such band, just a loosely tied group of musicians. "Musicians who have worked with Bruce Dickinson" is probably too vague for a category, as Occuli has pointed out correctly. Jimmy Fleischer (talk) 18:33, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Patti Smith band members

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: rename, can someone add a hatnote per the discussion, k thanks. Kbdank71 14:25, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Done.--Mike Selinker (talk) 16:16, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Propose renaming Category:Patti Smith band members to Category:Patti Smith Group members
Nominator's rationale: These are slightly different things. Category:Musicians by band allows for members of specific bands, but not just people associated with the music of a singer. The Patti Smith Group (active 1974-1979) contains all the members of this category.--Mike Selinker (talk) 05:02, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename per nom. (Wot, no mention of city/state?) Occuli (talk) 11:52, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep - For a future articles about Tony Snanahan and Oliver Ray, who was members of her band after dissolution of the Patti Smith Group. --The Watusi (talk) 13:37, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename per nom and correct name of the band. Otto4711 (talk) 13:58, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • but people in this category isn't in Patti Smith Group anymore. Since 1988 CD's and concert posters tittled "Patti Smith", not "Group" --The Watusi (talk) 21:40, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • Subcategories of Category:Musicians by band include present and former members of their groups (see the header, which says "Musicians by their bands, whether previous or current members").--Mike Selinker (talk) 22:40, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
        • and why does it need for? this act is have a number of titles: Patti Smith, Patti Smith Group, Patti Smith and Her Band. Category for this musicians, most of whom remains in band through this renames, must be called neutral and not by one of this title. (sorry for my englsh) --The Watusi (talk) 23:12, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
          • Category:Musicians by band doesn't categorize all musicians who played together. It categorizes musicians in named bands, and of these, only one, the Patti Smith Group, is an actual band. No albums were released under the name Patti Smith and Her Band, as far as I could tell.--Mike Selinker (talk) 00:26, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
            • There is no Patti Smith Group as a separate band. There is a Patti Smith with couple of long-time musicians and couple of those who come and go. Look, first she released two records labeled as "Patti Smith". Then (without changes in line-ip) they started write "Patti Smith Group". Now they very frequently type "Patti Smith and Her Band" at the concert announcements. And there IS an album released under the name Patti Smith and Her Band. So when you suggest to rename it to "Patti Smith Group" is like you make this category only for those musicians who was with Patti since 1976 to 1979 - it's not fair. And when I'll create article on her bass-guitarist who played with her since 1996 - in which category should I put him? --The Watusi (talk) 00:47, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
            • There two bass-players: Ivan Kral (1975-1979) and Tony Shanahan (1996-present). If we'll rename it to "Group" then Kral will be in this category and Shanahan - will not, cause he don't belong to the Patti Smith Group, despite that he no less important as a musician to Patti. There too much of bureaucratism in it. Leave it as it is or remove at all --The Watusi (talk) 01:32, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
            • Nominator, you just pay attention to this word "Group". But they are no less of the same group/band when they whote just "Patti Smith" on discs! --The Watusi (talk) 13:39, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
              • I have no objection to Shanahan and others being put into the category with a note reading "Members of the Patti Smith Group and other incarnations of Patti Smith's band", as long as the category name changes to "Patti Smith Group members".--Mike Selinker (talk) 21:37, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
                • Patti Smith Group covers five years of their existence. How you don't understand... Let's take Lenny Kaye who in this category for example: He is in her band since 1971 (before the name "patti smith group" taken) to present time (30 years after they don't use "patti smith group" label at all). Renaming category is like stating that he was active only five years and there was no Patti's band before or after. You said you agree with note than it contains all members outside of Patti Smith Group, but this note is not needed if the name of category would be some extensive statement as it now - "Patti Smith band members" is suitable perfectly. There is no need to rename it and to limit. Strongly oppose. --The Watusi (talk) 23:17, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Vanity record labels

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: keep and recommend that the article is renamed to match. Kbdank71 14:21, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Propose renaming Category:Vanity record labels to Category:Vanity labels
Nominator's rationale: To match parent article. Ten Pound Hammer and his otters • (Many otters • One hammer • HELP) 02:57, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Even so, it's still better to have the extra clarity whenever possible. And don't forget about HotCat, where there's no clue at all as to the parent cats or anything else. Cgingold (talk) 04:04, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
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