Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2025 January 19

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January 19

Questions

  1. Are there any newspapers in Serbia written in Serbian Latin alphabet?
  2. Are there any words in English with onsets /kn/, /ps/, /ks/, /tf/, /tv/, /kv/, /pw/, /fθ/ or /ts/?
  3. Are there any words in English where letter combinations ⟨iw⟩ and ⟨uw⟩ are pronounced as diphthongs, similarly to ⟨aw⟩ and ⟨ow⟩?
  4. Are there any words in Spanish where ⟨ll⟩ and ⟨ñ⟩ occur in consonant clusters, as in made-up words socllo, mopña, sollto and liñteda?
  5. Are there any words in Spanish where consonant clusters /tθ/, /kθ/, /pθ/, /tx/, /kx/ and /px/ occur, as in made-up words lotza, poczo, sopce, totja, hecge and mapjota?
  6. Are there any words in Korean with three consonants in a row? --40bus (talk) 21:02, 19 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
1 -- You can look at Romanization of Serbian. 2 -- Only in a few obviously incompletely-assimilated loanwords, such as "kvetch" or "tsetse fly". 3 -- "Uw" has never been an established English orthographic digraph, as far as I know (though it occurs in some incompletely-assimilated loanwords from Welsh). "Iw" may have been a marginal alternative to "Iu" centuries ago, but when the sounds written by "Iu" and "Eu" merged, there was no longer a real use for it. AnonMoos (talk) 21:44, 19 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
5. I guess -tz- might be found in loanwords from Basque or Native South American languages, but it's possible it might rather be pronounced as /ts/... 惑乱 Wakuran (talk) 22:49, 19 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
And historic names originating from other languages like Quetzalcoatl or Quetzaltenango. There are also words like lección but the pronounciation is represented as leɡˈθjon/ leɣ̞ˈθjõn rather than kθ. [1]. Ad 4. I don't think those exist either in regular Spanish words. -- 79.91.113.116 (talk) 11:14, 22 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
  • 1: Yes, even some of the highest-circulating ones: see the front pages for 20 January of Blic, Informer and Kurir (the latter also features a Cyrillic-script ad in-between). Although Serbian clearly favours Cyrillic for anything government-operated or Orthodoxy-related, in all other cases the two scripts are in free variation and it all depends on the author's or the publisher's preference.
  • 6: Orthographically that's possible when a character has a complex final and the next one has a non-silent initial, as in 읽다 ilgda. But phonologically any such clusters are simplified, so the actual pronunciation in this case is /ikt͈a/. --Theurgist (talk) 00:38, 20 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
  • 2: I tend to pronounce xi and psi as /ksaɪ/ and /psaɪ/ for disambiguation, though I might simplify them to /saɪ/ if only one of them is being used as a variable. Also I'd say kvetch with /kv/, phthalate with /fθ/, and tsetse with /ts/ (though maybe not everyone would). Further I'd use the German pronunciations for the chess borrowings zugzwang and zwischenzug (so the latter gives even initial /tsv/ for me). See also en:wikt:Category:English terms with initial /t͡s/. Double sharp (talk) 08:23, 20 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Double_sharp -- the standard traditional method for distinguishing the letters Xi and Psi in English, without attempting to produce word-initial consonant clusters, is to pronounce Xi with a [z] consonant, as in "Xylophone"... AnonMoos (talk) 14:57, 20 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@AnonMoos: I'm aware that it's standard (like "xylophone", "xylem", and "xenon"). Unfortunately I've heard xi with /s/ enough times (it's mentioned in Collins) that I don't trust anything but the clusters to disambiguate them by now. :) Double sharp (talk) 14:21, 21 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I don't really think they are consonant clusters, though. 惑乱 Wakuran (talk) 20:42, 22 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
That depends on which definition of consonant cluster you go with. OP has given us a list of examples, some of which have similar syllable structure to enllavar and conllevar, so I think they should qualify for purposes of this question. --Amble (talk) 21:06, 22 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Searching for "quechua" gives lliclla, aclla and chullpi. Searching for Aymara is left as an exercise for the reader. --Error (talk) 00:33, 24 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Are there any words in Spanish where consonant clusters /tθ/, /kθ/, /pθ/, /tx/, /kx/ and /px/ occur, as in made-up words lotza, poczo, sopce, totja, hecge and mapjota?

Quetzal in northern Spain. Acción, producción, and most of the cognates of *ction. Erupción, corrupción and most of the cognates of *ption. --Error (talk) 00:41, 24 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

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